I’m really excited this week because I’m joined once again on the program by my good friend Keith Henry. Now last time he was on the program – about a year ago – we had such a huge response. That’s because Keith’s done a lot of work in understanding personality types. Now, I’m not talking about all the world’s personality type systems – you know the Myers Briggs and all those other ones that people use. As someone said to me – why are you bothering with this stuff. It’s all old hat. Been there, done that. No, Keith’s gone back to God’s Word to discover that actually God Himself talks about the different personality types He’s created.

And the whole point of Keith’s work as I understand it – is for us to understand who God intended us to be. We’re made in His image and of course we’ve been marred by all the mistakes that we’ve made in life.

But if God wants to restore us back into His image – to be like Him – then what does that look like? You and I – we’re all different. Wouldn’t be great if we really truly knew who we are … and in fact who we aren’t. Wouldn’t it be amazing if we could locate ourselves – and not only ourselves but the people around us and by understanding who we all are and how it is that God’s wired each one of us differently inside – live the life that God had always planned. Live our lives to the full, by knowing who we are.

And that’s why Keith has called his work – the Personality GPS – it’s about locating ourselves. Is that right Keith?

Keith:Absolutely. And it’s great to be with you Berni.

Berni:Mate it’s great to have you back on the program. How have you been keeping?

Keith:Really, really well. Excited that you and I have been working together on this book, Personality GPS and I can’t wait for it to be out.

Berni:Yes, me neither. You really do get excited about this work the Personality GPS. We’ll explain what that means in a minutes. Actually, tell me about it right now. What’s the value proposition. Why is this tool different to all the other personality systems that have been around for ages.

Keith: Well the basic thing, Berni, is that all the other systems come from the world. They’re all about me, who I am, what I can get out of life. But with Jesus it’s about living life to the full. Not so much about what can get but what we can give. How can we let the love of God flow us and into other people and the world. One day I was reading in Romans Chapter 12 and it struck me, it’s who we are in God that brings us up to being all that we can be. Finding our function and meaning in who we are and what we can have but in being in the right relationship with God and with other people.

Berni: Makes sense doesn’t it. You think about it as a performer, a virtuoso violinist. And if the violinist doesn’t have an audience it doesn’t mean much, you can be a leader or an encourager or whatever you are. But if there is no one to lead and no one to encourage … well, so what?

Keith:Absolutely. So discovering our personality type is so important. It’s who we are. Who other people are, so we can live together with a powerful sense of community.

Berni:Why GPS? What’s this all about?

Keith:Well Berni, I’m an encourager and one of the things with us is that I get lost all the time. My wife’s like that. I can’t find my way around. I’m not spatially very strong. GPS satellite navigation in the car is all about knowing where you are and never getting lost. So many people are lost in their relationships and in their lives. They don’t know who they are or what they’ve been made to do. They can’t understand what other people are and so relationships are a mess and they can never really experience the plan that God has for their lives.

Berni: OK. I remember landing in England once. It was dark, my plane was late and I had to get to somewhere. It was the first time I used the GPS and it was just wonderful. It really took the stress out of things so I can really relate to that. It’s a good title – Personalty GPS. And over the next 3 weeks on the program as I understand it Keith, you are going to be with us explaining that in quite a bit of depth.

Keith:Absolutely Berni, not just me but we’re also going to be interviewing people, one of each of the nine personality types.

Berni:That’s really good. I’m looking forward to that. Now, Keith you talk about the nine personality types. As I understand things, you’ve gone back to the source, God’s Word, the Bible, to discover those types. Is that correct?

Keith:Where else Berni. And I so struck me how clear it is. It’s been there all along. This thing about Personality Types, if only we would have a look at Romans Chapter 12 in the New Testament.

Berni:OK. Let’s have a look then. I’m going to read it from the Message translation. It’s a really contemporary take on all of this. Have a listen, Romans Chapter 12 beginning at Verse 2:

Unlike the culture around you, always dragging down to it’s level of immaturity, God brings the best out of you and develops well-formed maturity in you. It’s important that you don’t misinterpret yourselves as people who are bringing this goodness to God. No! God brings it all to you. The only accurate way to understand ourselves is by what God is and by what He does for us. Not by what we are and what we do for Him.

In this way, we’re all like the various parts of the human body. Each part gets it’s meaning from the body as a whole. Not the other way around. The body we’re talking about is Christ’s body of chosen people. Each of us finds our meaning and a function as a part of this body. But as a chopped off finger or a cut off toe, we wouldn’t amount to much would we?

So since we find ourselves fashioned into these excellently formed and marvellously functioning parts of Christ’s body, let’s just go ahead and be what we were made to be, without enviously or pridefully comparing ourselves with one another or trying to be something that we aren’t.

If you preach, just preach God’s message, nothing else. If you help, just help don’t take over. If you teach stick to your teaching. If you give encouraging guidance be careful you don’t get bossy. If you’re put in charge, don’t manipulate. If you’re called to give aid to people in distress keep your eyes open and be quick to respond. If you work with the disadvantaged don’t let yourself get irritated with them or depressed by them. Keep a smile on your face. Love from the centre of who you are and don’t fake it.

Berni:Pretty powerful stuff isn’t it Keith. What does this do in your heart for you? What do you learn from this passage?

Keith:Well, here in Romans Chapter 12 this is what makes the Personality GPS so different. I love the way it says that we only discover our meaning and our function in relationship with God and with other people. What you were saying before about the virtuoso violinist, it’s about knowing who we are as part of the body. That picture of the chopped off finger and the toe – how useless, but that’s what the whole ‘me’ centred world is all about – it’s useless.

The power of what God’s saying here is that we find our meaning and our fulfilment in serving one another. And that’s the truth of it. That’s what Personality GPS is all about. That’s what we’re going to be talking about over the next three weeks.

Berni: Ain’t that the truth. I spent the first 36 years of my life doing the ‘chopped off finger’ thing. I didn’t realise it, but how obvious is it that it just doesn’t work. And as far as I can see, what this Personality GPS things is all about is being restored back into God’s image. Back the way we were meant to be. I don’t know if you remember Keith that painting, Rembrandt’s night watch. And when they first found it, they thought it was a night scene, but when they cleaned it up and took the dark lacquer off, they discovered it was a daytime scene. And that’s what this Personality GPS strikes me about. It’s about getting back to who God intended us to be and who God made us to be. Is that what it’s about?

Keith:That’s right Berni. Exactly.

Berni:I think it’s awesome when I landed that time in the UK when it was dark and it was wet and I had to navigate from London’s Heathrow up into the midlands where I was going in the middle of the night. It was a scary thing. But just having that GPS made it really easy. And my hunch is, if we can discover who we are, you discover who you are, me who I am, all of a sudden relationships become clear. Who we are, what we’re meant to do where we are meant to be going become clear.

Keith:That’s right.

It’s Tuesday and here we are again. I have my good friend Keith Henry with me on the program. Keith has done a lot of work understanding the different personality types that God has created in each one of us. I mean blind Freddy can see that we’re all different – some people are natural born leaders and others are natural born encouragers.

Problem is unless we really understand which one of those God created us to be – well, how can we ever live our lives out to the full.

And that’s where Keith’s done a lot of work to understand the personality types that God talks about in Romans Chapter 12 in the New Testament – and he’s produced this thing he’s called ‘Personality GPS’. A way I guess of understanding who we are – not based on some worldly system, but based on what God has to say.
Based on discovering our meaning and our purpose through our relationship with God and with other people.

This is about discovering who we are so that we can participate in God’s nature – so we can be restored back into God’s image. It’s about transformation – that’s right isn’t it Keith ?

Keith:That’s right Berni. Fulfilment is what happens when we’re living out who God made us to be. For other people, for Him not for ourselves.

Berni:Now for today and rest of the week we’re going to kick this off by discovering that each one of us tends to see life and experience life through a different aspect of who God’s made us to be. Can you explain that to us Keith.

Keith:That’s so important Berni. We don’t realise how differently we all see the world. We kind of know that some people are more emotional, some people are more logical or rational and we know that the emotional person sees things differently from the rational person. Actually Jesus identified four different parts of who we are. And each one of us tends to see the world more through one of those than the other.

Berni:Jesus identified four? Are you saying this stuff is in the Bible?

Keith:Have a listen to this.

You shall the Lord your God with your heart with all your soul and with all your strength and with all your mind and your neighbour as yourself.

Our heart – that’s our emotions; our strength – that’s our will; our mind – that’s the rational, reasoning part of us; and our soul – well that’s all of us, all three the heart the will and the mind together.
Some people refer to that as our mind, our will and our emotions – that’s the soul.

Berni:So that comes from Luke Chapter 10 and Verse 27. So help us understand this. In this tool that you’ve developed ‘The Personality GPS’ which is based on God’s Word, how do we make sense of that? How do we understand these four different parts that we come from.

Keith:Well remember Berni I’m not very spatial. It’s so easy for me to get lost. That’s why I’ve used a simple clock face. Something that we can all relate to easily. Now there’s nine personality types based on those listed in Romans Chapter 12. And we spread them all around the clock face but like ones are grouped together. And we’re going to look first at those between 12 o’clock and 3 o’clock. These are the holistic people. They actually are the big picture people, the big thinkers. They range from the first quadrant from 12 o’clock to 3 o’clock. The second quadrant from 3 o’clock to 6 o’clock are the heart people. These are the personality types who see and experience the world mostly through their emotions and feelings. The personality types that use their minds, now they are the 6 o’clock to 9 o’clock people. They come from detail and analysis. And finally the personality types from 9 o’clock to 12 o’clock. These are willed type. These are the strong people. The strong willed.

Berni:Yes, I like this clock face idea because it’s easy for us to sit here and talk about it and it becomes abstract and we list all the personality types. But let me go through it again and make sure I’ve got it. So the way you’ve done it is with the clock face and from the first quadrant from 12 o’clock to 3 o’clock these are the holistic bigger thinkers, the party animals if you like. Their the soul people. Right?

Keith:Right

Berni:Then from 3 o’clock to 6 o’clock you’ve got a couple of personality types in there and they’re the heart people. They’re the people that come at the world through their emotions and feelings.
From 6 o’clock to 9 o’clock they’re the detail people, the thinkers, the mind people. Yes?

Keith:Yes

Berni:Then from 9 o’clock to 12 o’clock, we’re back up the top again, They’re the strong willed people, the leader types.

Keith:Full of action. They get things done.

Berni:I want you to tell us about the first group of people. Because the other three quadrants we are going to look at over the next few days. I want to come and have a look at the soul people, these big picture people. Tell me how I know that I’m in that quadrant.

Keith:Well, these as you said are the big picture people. They are enthusiastic, they’re exciting. They’re very socially orientated. They’re the life of the party generally.

Berni:Not quiet and shy like me. Keep going. Sorry.

Keith: So what they’re good at, and really strong at is brain-storming. If you want some new ideas and out of the square thinking these are the big picture people. They are innovative, enthusiastic and very encouraging type people.

Berni:OK. So I always like to pick something really tangible as an example. And one of the things that I think a lot of us have been through in life is going on a long car drive. I mean, here in Australia we can drive for days and days and days and still be in the middle of nowhere. Let’s imagine that we’re going on a long car trip, right?

Keith:Yes.

Berni: And there’s one of each of the four people from those four quadrants in the car, tell me about the ‘soul’ person. How is the ‘soul’ person going to approach this long car trip?

Keith:Well, they’re going to have fun. This is a journey. This is an exciting experience they’re all going to do. They’ll get up in the morning when they’re ready, they’ll take off. No particular time. And they’ll stop on the way and find some exciting things to do. They might me hot so they’ll go for a swim. And then with a ten hour drive they won’t get there today because that’s too hard. So what they’ll do, they’ll find a nice place to stay. They’ll find some accommodation and get there the following day. Nothing’s a rush it’s all going to be fun.

Berni: That’s a lot different to the way I would handle it. But we’ll talk about that another day. So tell me, you’ve got three personality types in this quadrant. Just quickly give me each of those three because we are going to look at them in more detail next week.

Keith:Well first of all there’s the encourager and we break the encourager up into two types.

Berni:Because the encourager is the one that comes from Romans Chapter 12, right?

Keith:Right. The first one is the achieving encourager because they like to achieve. They set goals and they achieve things. They’re inspirational. Then the second type is the social encourager. That is the life of the party. They’re the entertainers. And the third group is the teacher. Now the teacher is not as extrovert but they’re still the optimist and they like having the fun. But they’re very relationship orientated.

Berni:So let me get this right. First quadrant – 1 o’clock is the achieving encourager, 2 o’clock is the social encourager and 3 o’clock is the teacher. And as I understand it, next week on the program we’re going to have one of each of those personality types, real people, come into the studio and tell us about their lives.

Keith:And that will be interesting.

Berni:Yes, I’m really, really looking forward to that. It’s awesome stuff. Now Keith with these people who are in this first quadrant. Why do we need them? I mean what would you and I miss out on if we didn’t have them around.

Keith:These are the people who have the saying “To boldly go where they’ve never been before”.

Berni:Ah, Startreck episode 1.

Keith:They don’t know what’s ahead but isn’t it going to be exciting to find out.
Berni:So why do we need them though? What’s their value to me?

Keith:Well, the value is that they don’t mind taking risks and they want to enjoy life so they take you out of the normal living, the boring, normal boundaries that you’re enticed in. And they set you free to experience life, all that it has. And in business they all set you free to look at innovative ideas. Without them nothing would happen.

Berni: Without them, I guess we are stuck in the same old, same old again.

Keith:We are.

Berni:That can be exciting but it can be a bit frustrating too. Is that right Keith?

Keith:That’s right.

Here we are again today I have my good friend Keith Henry with me on the program. Keith, if you’ve joined us earlier this week – has done a lot of work in understanding the different personality types that God’s created in each one of us. It’s something he calls ‘Personality GPS’ – a tool to help each one of us discover who we are so we can live out our lives to the full. Not for ourselves but for one another. That’s the key difference.

Now Romans Chapter 12 Verse 2 tells us not to be squeezed into the world’s mould but to be transformed by the renewing of our minds. And right after that in the very next verse the Apostle Paul goes on to say that we basically need to figure out who we are – with sober judgement. Right after that he goes on to list effectively the different personality types – or motivational giftings, as some people call them, that Keith’s based his work on.

So this ‘Personality GPS’ thing is right there in God’s Word– it’s not something that Keith’s dreamt up. God wants you and me to understand not just who we are, but who the other people are in our lives so that we can really live have a fantastic life.
Keith, have I got that right?

Keith:You have Berni. If we try and live our lives just for ourselves, that selfishness and it just won’t work. We won’t be fulfilled. It’s only when we really look at who we’ve been made to be and actually follow the directions of who we’re made to be, then we’ll accomplish so much in life.

Berni:I don’t know about you Keith, but I really love this bit in Romans Chapter 12. I think it’s worth revisiting today. And again, we’re using the Message translation because it just picks up particularly contemporary language in this passage that we can understand. If you want to have a look it’s in Romans Chapter 12 Verse 2. Here is how it goes. Let me share it with you:

Unlike the culture around you, which is always dragging down to it’s level of immaturity, God brings the best out of you and develops well-formed maturity in you. It’s important that you don’t misinterpret yourselves as people who are bringing this goodness to God. No! God brings it all to you. The only accurate way to understand ourselves is by what God is and by what He does for us. Not by what we are and what we do for Him.

In this way, we’re all like the various parts of the human body. Each part gets it’s meaning from the body as a whole. Not the other way around. The body we’re talking about is Christ’s body of chosen people. Each of us finds our meaning and a function as a part of this body. But as a chopped off finger or a cut off toe, we wouldn’t amount to much would we?

So since we find ourselves fashioned into these excellently formed and marvellously functioning parts of Christ’s body, let’s just go ahead and be what we were made to be, without enviously or pridefully comparing ourselves with one another or trying to be something that we aren’t.

If you preach, just preach God’s message, nothing else. If you help, just help don’t take over. If you teach stick to your teaching. If you give encouraging guidance be careful you don’t get bossy. If you’re put in charge, don’t manipulate. If you’re called to give aid to people in distress keep your eyes open and be quick to respond. If you work with the disadvantaged don’t let yourself get irritated with them or depressed by them. Keep a smile on your face.

Keith, it’s powerful stuff, isn’t it. God through Paul, is basically saying to us ‘For goodness sake figure out who you are and get on with being who I made you to be’. Isn’t this what this is saying?

Keith:God is certainly saying that. And what a useless way to live our lives if it’s all about me. We’re never going to be happy yet all the personality systems in the world are produced to actually show us who we are selfishly.

Berni:OK. That means you get to be a cut off finger and I get to be a cut off toe. Yippee!

Keith:Yes, so how can we do anything together or achieve anything together or achieve a lot. It’s all about me and what I want is not what you want.

Berni:But the bit that really leaps out here for me is that Romans Chapter 12 Verse 5 it says: “Each of us finds our meaning and our function as a part of this body”. So I’m only useful as a leader when I’m around you. You’re only useful as an encourager when you’re around me.

Keith:That’s right. And here we are together doing this radio program.

Berni:Absolutely. And writing a book together which we’ll talk about another time. OK Keith today we’re moving on to talk about the people who see the world and experience the world and contribute to life more through their emotions than say through their mind and their will. The personality types that come from the heart. Now just recap for me this Personality GPS thing is a tool that’s based on Romans Chapter 12. It’s a tool for understanding ourselves and other people God’s way, as you say. How does it work again?

Keith:It’s really simple Berni. We use the clock face. In Romans Chapter 12 it talks about seven personality types which we develop into nine as we explained earlier this week. Now, we divide those into four quadrants. So for instance, we looked yesterday at 12 o’clock to 3 o’clock and that was the holistic type person. Today we’re looking at the emotional type person, the heart people and they are between 3 o’clock and 6 o’clock.

Berni:So, it’s a really simple clock face. We looked at those holistic people yesterday. Let’s go now to look at these heart people, these emotional people. I guess we all know people who come at the world through their emotions. But tell me how do I know if I am one of those personality types that lives in this quadrant from 3 o’clock to 6 o’clock – the heart people? How do I know?

Keith:Well, these are the ‘people’ people. They are relationship people. It’s all about feelings. They have strong feelings for others and also for themselves. For instance, they’d look at personal meaning in any decisions that are made. How will that affect me? How will that affect others? They’re good at listening. They won’t tell you what do, they’ll listen, they’ll empathise with you. So they’re real feeling emotionally and heart people.

Berni:So you said there are two personality types in this quadrant.

Keith:One at 4 o’clock that’s the carer

Berni: And one at 5 o’clock.

Keith:That’s the giver.

Berni:Tell me a little bit about these two quickly.

Keith:The carer is sensitive to people’s feelings. They’re the one’s if your hurting they’ll look after you. They will empathise with you. And the 5 o’clock is the giver. Now these people are sensitive to peoples needs, their physical needs. If they see anything that you need they’re the ones that will do it for you.

Berni:It’s pretty obvious we need these emotional people around. For people like me, emotional people can be a bit frustrating because they come at the world from their emotions whereas I don’t. But if we didn’t have them around it would be a pretty cruel old world, wouldn’t it?

Keith:Yes, it would be a cold world wouldn’t it? We need the warmth that they generate.

Berni:Yesterday when we looked at the holistic people we used that example of lets imagine we are going on a long car ride, a big long car ride. How would one of these heart people approach a big long car ride?

Keith:Well, they’re very interesting. What they’re going to do is look at the well-being of everybody in the car. So they’ll say. I’ll bring some drinks for us, because you might get thirsty on the way. I’ll get some snacks in case you get hungry. Maybe I’ll bring along some games we can play. I’ll bring along some tapes and what I’ll do, I’ll put it all at my feet on the floor so that anything anybody needs at any time I can go to it straight away.

Berni:That’s exactly what my wife does. Exactly when we go on a car drive. I keep saying to her, ‘Why do you put all this stuff at your feet? Why don’t you put it on the back seat.” I guess because she wants to help.

Keith:She wants to help right then and there.

Berni:That is awesome stuff. So Keith, just to wrap up very quickly. What do you think the biggest mistake the rest of us can make when we’re dealing with these heart people.

Keith:To try and bully them and try to pressure them. Because they are interested in feelings. They aren’t about tasks and projects, they’re about you.

Berni:That’s good stuff. Thanks Keith.

Keith:Thanks Berni.

Let me ask you something, if you had to stand up in front a group of friends and in five minutes explain your personality type to them – what motivates you, how you’re wired, how they can get the most of their relationship with you – would you be able to do that?

My hunch is that the vast majority probably wouldn’t be able to. If we don’t truly understand ourselves – who God’s made us to be, ho He’s wired us on the inside, then we’ve got no show of understanding the other people in our lives.

And if we don’t ever stop to understand and appreciate ourselves and others – how do we imagine that we’re going to be able to have great relationships and live life to the full? You know when Jacqui my wife and I were first married, it wasn’t long and I figured out that it wasn’t enough for me to want to love her, I had to discover how to love her.

And in order to know that – I had to understand her. What motivates her. What makes her tick. Where she’s coming from. Makes sense doesn’t it?

That’s why I’m joined again today by my good friend Keith Henry – a man who’s spent years developing a really simple approach to doing just that. It’s called Personality GPS and it’s based on the motivational giftings or personality types in Chapter 12 of the Book of Romans in the New Testament.
Keith, welcome again today on the program

Keith:Thank you Berni. Great to be here.

Berni:Now for anyone who hasn’t been able to join us so far on the program this week, Keith’s been with us explaining how differently God’s made each one of us. And based on God’s Word, Keith developed this simple tool Personality GPS. Now Keith, really quickly – before we dive into looking at the next group of personality types, the people that come from the mind – tell us for anyone who hasn’t been with us over the past week, in a nutshell, what is Personality GPS.

Keith:Well Personality GPs comes from God’s Word in Romans Chapter 12 where Paul talks about all the different personality types and so we can recognise them easily we’ve used a clock face and we divide into four quadrants first of all. And so we have the holistic people on the clock face from 12 till 3 o’clock. We’ve looked at the heart people from 3 o’clock to 6 o’clock.

Berni:The ones that come from their emotions.

Keith:Yes, the feeling people. Today we’re going to look at the mind people. The thinking people who come from 6 o’clock to 9 o’clock.

Berni:Okay. And then the last quadrant from 9 till 12 o’clock are the people who exercise their will – the strong people.

Keith:That’s you Berni.

Berni:Yes. The people that you said to me before have like a V8 under the bonnet.

Keith:That’s right.

Berni:Yes. I’m looking forward to that tomorrow.
Well, we’ve met those people and we’ve looked at the GPS tool. But we’re now going from 6 to 9 on the clock face which are the people that come from their minds. Now these ‘mind people’ – (Can I tell you something, can I be honest, just between you and me? Lets ignore that there is anyone listening) the mind people are the ones that drive me nuts quickest. I find the ‘mind’ people sometimes really, really frustrating. Why is that? Tell me about these mind people. The people that come from their mind as their reason. How do I know if I’m one of those.

Keith:Well, you’re not Berni.

Berni:Thank you. Thank you.

Keith:I’ll give you an illustration. You’re a quick decision maker. Get the facts, move on, next thing done. The way they think are the detail people so before we make any decision, it’s going to be a slow decision because we’re going to analyse all the facts. We’re going to research it. We’re going to read the operators manual even.

Berni:I never do that. When I’m putting kids toys together on Christmas morning, after an hour of frustration, the last thing I do is read the manual.

Keith:That’s right. Well, that’s the first thing they do. Because they don’t want to get it wrong.

Berni:So have them over on Christmas morning when you’re putting the toys together.

Keith:When you can’t figure our what to do, they’ll do it all for you but it’s very slow. They have to analyse, work out all the details, research then proceed based on the facts that they have.

Berni:Well, when you think about it that means a good contrast between the quick decision maker and the people who want to go through the detail. If you’re wanting to send a rocket ship to the moon if you don’t have the detail people you probably not going to get there however quickly the decision maker was to make their decision. So we actually need the people who want to work through the detail.

Keith:Well, you think of an accountant. The financial people, the tradespeople building a house can’t get it wrong, it would fall down.

Berni:Now you’ve got two personality types in this particular quadrant. And they’re based on one of the personality types in Romans Chapter 12. Is that right?

Keith:That’s right. Explain that to us. Why have you taken one out of Romans Chapter 12 and broken into the two. They are the servers. These are the people who think with the mind. But there’s two different types there. One is the practical server. They research things and actually do things practically. They’re very tactile. For instance, it might be a person who could be a computer person but it could be somebody in a trade. They can build it, they can do that. The second one is the theoretical server. So these actually just love going into a library, reading all the books. Reading about every subject.

Berni:Sorry to librarians out there. I hate going to libraries.

Keith:Librarians are often those people because they just love being in that theoretical world. And university professors, not all of them, but some of them would be that type. Research.

Berni:That’s really good. So these are the people that do the detail for us. You know, when I look at it, we’ll talk about my personality type tomorrow, which is the leader. But I deliberately surround myself with detail people. I can do the detail but it’s not my first love. And so, if I don’t have those detail people with me I have to end up doing the detail and I don’t want to do the detail.

Keith:That’s what we said earlier. We have to be part of the body. The other part of the body are the details people.

Berni:That’s awesome. So these two personality types, the practical server who is at 7 o’clock on the clock face and the theoretical server who’s at 8 o’clock on the clock face. Awesome stuff. And again, the week after next, we’re going to meet one of each of those two personality types right here on the program, so that we can really dive into the detail of each of those and figure out whether that’s us or not. Right? That’s what we’re going to do?

Keith:Yes, we are Berni.

Berni:I’m really looking forward to that. I’m really looking forward to meeting these detail people and figuring out how they’re wired. Now, over the last couple of days when we looked at the holistic people from 1 o’clock to 3 o’clock and then we looked at the heart people from 3 o’clock to 6 o’clock I asked you a question about a situation. We’re going on a long car trip and told me how the holistic people would handle a long car trip. You told me how the heart people would handle a long car trip. Tell me how the detail people are going to handle the long car trip.

Keith:Well, first they are going to research where they’re going to. They’ll know every point on the journey that they’re going to take. For instance, they know that there’s a castle on the way that they might call into. So they’ll plan that at 2.00 pm tomorrow we’ll call in to see the castle, and then 5.00 pm we’ll stop for dinner. They’ll have it all planned, all the details. For instance I have a friend who did a seven months trip around Australia and he knew every night for seven months where he would be.

Berni:See, this is why they drive me nuts. Can you believe that? Every night for seven months. Do they every kind of deviate and party and have fun.

Keith:They allow time. They might allow three days to actually deviate.

Berni:Okay. Looking forward to meeting them next week. Keith, it’s been great talking to you today.

Keith:Thanks Berni.

It’s fantastic to be with you again and can you believe it, it’s Friday already? Time flies when you’re having fun and we’ve been having a lot of fun on the program here this week with my good friend Keith Henry.

If you’ve been with us during the week you’ll know that Keith’s a man who’s gone into God’s word to discover that God made us all differently and we need to understand ourselves and others. How our different personalities have been wired differently so that we can live out our lives to the full.

And the way Keith’s been helping us to do that is by this simple tool, Personality GPS. Which kind of sets the nine different personality types, based on Romans chapter 12, on a simple clock face. The different personality types are grouped together in four different quadrants.

The other day we looked at the holistic personality types. The people who see the big picture. These are the ‘soul’ people from 12 o’clock to 3 o’clock on the clock face. Then there were the people who are motivated by their emotions primarily, the ‘heart’ people. From 3 o’clock to 6 o’clock on the clock face.

And then we looked at the people who come at things through their minds. These are the detailed people. From 6 o’clock to 9 o’clock on the clock face. And today we’re going to look at the last group, from 9 ’til 12. The people who come at things through their will. These are the strong people.

Berni: Isn’t it funny how we want other people to be like us? I mean, in fact, the more I think about it the more that’s probably why people don’t get on together. Either they clash or they just kind of drift apart and never get close.

Keith: Berni, in a sense you’ve hit the nail right on the head. It’s what personality GPS is all about and you know what, I love the message translation of Romans chapter 12 because it really brings out what Gods been saying to us all along. It’s a contemporary way of understanding who we are.

Berni: Okay, let’s have a look at it again. I like it too. Romans chapter 12, beginning at verse 2 through to verse 6. Let’s read it:

“Unlike the culture around you which is always dragging you down to it’s level of immaturity, God brings out the best in you and develops a well formed maturity in you. It’s important that you don’t misinterpret yourselves as people who are bringing this goodness to God. No, no. God brings it all to you. The only accurate way to understand ourselves is by what God is and by what He does. Not by who we are and what we do for Him.”

“In this way, we’re like the various parts of a human body. Each part gets it’s meaning from the body as a whole, not the other way around. The body we’re talking about is Christ’s body of chosen people. Each of us finds our meaning and our function as part of His body. But as a chopped off finger or a cut off toe we wouldn’t amount to much, would we?”

“So since we find ourselves fashioned into all these excellently formed and marvellously functioning parts of Christ’s body, let’s just go ahead and be what we are made to be. Without enviously or pridefully comparing ourselves with each other or trying to be something or someone that we aren’t.”

Keith: The worlds culture, the ‘me, me, me’ thing, really drags us down. And Paul talks about pride. As a part of that, do you know what we do? We assume that everyone should be just like us.

Berni: Well shouldn’t they? (Both laugh) Sorry.

Keith: Well we do think that actually and get disappointed. They should see things the way that we see things. They should do things the way that we do them. And so often we have these prideful expectations of people which won’t be met because, wait for it, they’re different to us.

Berni: Oh, is that what it is? (Both laugh)

Keith: That’s what it is. That’s the whole point and that’s why we need to understand how we’re hard wired and what other people are and how they’re hard wired. How they see things. What they’re good at. What their personality type is. Otherwise we’d just all be cut off fingers and cut off toes and we’d be trying to be something that we’re not.

Berni: And I guess Keith that’s what this simple tool that you’ve developed, Personality GPS, is all about. Us finding our meaning and our function. Not as a cut off finger or a cut off toe but in our relationship with God and in our relationship with other people. I mean, think about it, the eye would be pretty useless unless it had a body to go with, wouldn’t it?

Keith: It would be.

Berni: And the finger’s pretty useless unless it’s got a body to go with.

Keith: That’s right.

Berni: Well let’s go on now and have a look at the last of the four quadrants. Over these last few days, as we’ve said, we’ve looked at each of the different motivations that we come from. The other day we looked at the ‘soul’ people from 12 o’clock til 3 o’clock on the GPS clock face. Then we looked at the ‘heart’ people from 3 o’clock to 6 o’clock. Yesterday we looked at the ‘mind’ people, the detail people, from 6 o’clock to 9 o’clock. And today we’re going to a place that I’m really going to enjoy, we’re going to look at the ‘will’ people from 9 o’clock to 12 o’clock on the clock face.

So tell us about the personality types we find in this fourth quadrant. 9 o’clock to 12 o’clock. The ‘will’ people, the strong people. How do we know if we’re in this particular quadrant? How do we know if this is where we come from, through the will?

Keith: Well, as you said, they’re strong will people. Now what they’re about is action. You know that saying ‘just do it now’. That’s them. They’re practical and realistic. They’re good at making decisions. Most people aren’t good at making decisions but they will make decisions and get on with it now. They’re quick, they’re firm decisions and they put them into action. They don’t, sort of, talk about them for a long time before doing them. And they’re great at problem solving. So they’re the ones that climb the mountains and deep sea diving and do all the adrenalin things.

Berni: Yeah, I can kind of relate to that. These are my kind of people. The other day we talked about, we get all these different people, four different people. One of the heart people, one of the soul people, one of the mind people and now, one of these will people and we’re all going on a big long car ride. We’re going to drive 1,000 miles across the country in the car.

Keith: Yes.

Berni: Now tell me about the ‘will’ people. Tell me how they would approach it, a big long car drive.

Keith: Well everything’s a project to them Berni. So if it’s a ten hour car drive, okay we’re all up at 5.30 am, we’re off at 6.00 am on the dot and we won’t stop ’til we get there.

Berni: Yo, you beauty!

Keith: That’s the project, is getting there, it’s not the journey on the way.

Berni: Yes. Absolutely. Now what are the two personality types here in this ‘will’ quadrant? You’ve got one at 10 o’clock and one at 11 o’clock. Tell me about those two quickly.

Keith: That’s right. The 10 o’clock is the prophet. They’re the people who are black and white.

Berni: Now this is a funny word. We don’t hear that word ‘prophet’ in common usage much anymore. So they’re black and white.

Keith: Well I suppose you could call them the righteous ones, right. There’s a right way and there’s a wrong way. A correct way and a incorrect way. That’s how they see life. They also see life internally because they have to be correct. So while they’re not strong willed, necessarily, always outside, externally. They’re strong internally. They don’t want to do the wrong thing. They have high integrity, that sort of person. Now if you look at the strong willed leader type personality, this is the 11 o’clock.

Berni: The 11 o’clock. So the prophet at 10 o’clock, the leader at 11 o’clock in this quadrant.

Keith: Right. They are out to conquer the world. They use their will externally to drive things, to get things done, to accomplish things. Action people.

Berni: Okay. These people in the ‘will’ quadrant, what do we miss out on if we don’t have them? I mean, why do we need them around?

Keith: They are the project leaders. The prophet is often the manager and often the engineer and the leader is the leader of the pack. They’re the ones going out and setting the project, getting it started and getting it finished. ‘Cause that’s very unusual in personalities, actually getting something started and finishing it and that’s what they do, they drive it.

Berni: Keith, it’s been a great week with you on the program. Now next couple of weeks on the program, we’ve talked about really quickly, only a high level look at each of the nine personality types across these four quadrants on the clock face. But over the next couple of weeks, you’ve organised something special for us, tell us that.

Keith: What we’re going to do is get one of each personality type and we’re actually going to talk to them about how they think about the world.

Berni: Well that is going to be really interesting. In the next couple of weeks on the program, I don’t want to miss out of that so I’m going to be here.

Keith: Terrific.